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Author	Topic: Scramasax design.
AlexI Member	posted 12-26-2000 11:41 AM Hi everybody, this is my first post at this forum, though I have been lurking here for quite a long time. I post at the Swordforum sometimes, but it seems to me that this particular question may be better answered by the Netsword experts. I'm researching scramasax design as a possible knifemaking project. I would like to keep it plausibly authentic, at least in general design if not construction details (Anglo-Saxon or Viking, approximately during the Viking Age). I have most of the generally available books on the subject, and did some Net research as well (including some great threads in the Netsword archives). As a result, I have a lot of info on blade types and sheath design, but precious few hints on handles! Since somebody already tried simply asking about scramasaxes, I decided to try another approach: post some design drawings that I was able to come up with and invite your expert opinion on them. I hope this will produce an interesting discussion: http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Tower/1047/pics/scrams_designs.jpg The blade in both designs is 14" long, 1.25" - 1.5" wide, slightly curved back. Maybe with some runes etched near the back? The sheath is leather, stitched and maybe covered with metal strip along the blade edge. Encloses at least half of the handle and intended to be suspended almost horizontally from the belt. The hanle is 5" long and I have 2 designs at this point: - the upper design is based on some Salamander Armory reproductions that I have seen and liked, and to some extent on a reconstruction drawing in a book called "The Viking". The bolster and pommel plates can be decorated with filework, composed of several plates, etc. The handle of wood/horn can have some runes inscribed around the central piece? -the lower design is based mostly on some of the modern Scandinavian knife handles, and somewhat on widespread descriptions of "simple handles of wood or horn, without pommels". It is all wood (mapple or some other hardwood?), with the exception of a metal bolster plate. I would appreciate any comments or discussion, especially if you happened to see something in some museum collection or a book that can confirm or rule out one of my designs! Alex. [This message has been edited by AlexI (edited 12-26-2000).] [This message has been edited by AlexI (edited 12-26-2000).] IP: Logged
FullerH Administrator	posted 12-26-2000 04:24 PM I should think that the hilt on the second design is rather too modern in appearance for an historical reproduction, which is what you seem to be aiming at. Shadrake's book, "Barbarian Warriors" has pictures of several historic seaxes as well as some of Ivor Lawton's reproductions, both of which are splendid. Please remember that a seax was a working weapon/tool and was hilted with whatever was convenient, such as antler, bone, wood, or whatever. A friend of mine is making one and using a hardwood for the hilt and capping it with a reproduction Roman coin of appropriate size. He is using the coin to show off his wealth, as he is re-enacting a wealthy Saxon thegn with enough wherewithal to have a full byrnie of mail as well as a sword and helmet, shield and spear. ------------------ Walk in the Light, Hugh IP: Logged
AlexI Member	posted 12-27-2000 08:26 AM You are right, the second design looks too much like some of the modern kitchen knives. And the first one is probably too exotic with that "trumpeted" shape. Even if that reconstruction in "The Viking" was correct, most closes and other objects in that grave display heavy Eastern influence according to the book. I'm thinking about another design now, based on a drawing you can see here: http://www.regia.org/scram.htm It is in the third picture down (showing 5 scram shapes), the one in the bottom left corner. It actually has something in common with my first design, with less "extreme" shape, but still offers some possibilities for decoration. I can change the outline of the handle a little for comfort, but I like the overall idea. BTW, I don't worry much about "overdecorating", as I'm not after absolutely faithfull reproduction. Rather I want a weapon that clearly says "seax" when you look at it, but still looks somewhat better than an average utilitarian chopper. After all, when you look at some "upscale" seax blades with their intricate inlays and/or pattern welded blades, it is really hard to believe that their owners would just put a simple piece of hardwood on them for a handle... Alex. IP: Logged
FullerH Administrator	posted 12-27-2000 09:33 AM If you are doing this for re-enactment purposes, you need to remember that Anglo-Saxon barbarians and those damned Vikings, that from the point of view of a sub-Roman British Celt, loved to show off finery and decoration, so decorating the hilt would be in keeping with the character, unless your character was a stone poor peasant, but even then he would decorate as best he could. ------------------ Walk in the Light, Hugh IP: Logged
Alasdayr Kilgour Member	posted 12-27-2000 03:47 PM Hi Alex! Welcome to the forum! I rather like your first design. I'v done several dirks with similar grips and find them both comfortable & secure. BTW- A section of cow femur (bone) already has that shape & polishes up beautifully. ;-) [This message has been edited by Alasdayr Kilgour (edited 12-27-2000).] IP: Logged
AlexI Member	posted 12-28-2000 12:44 PM I think that the first handle design looks somewhat out of place on this kind of blade. I mean that it is simmetrical and would look right with a dagger blade, or dirk. So my next (and hopefully final) design is here: http://www.geocities.com/aindman/pics/scram_design3.jpg obviously based on the drawing from the regia.org article(see above). I plan to use nickel silver for thin bolster and pommel plates; polished stag or bone spacers fore and aft (pobably with some runes or other simple carving around); black ebony wood decorated with nickel silver pins (not sure about pattern yet) for the handle itself. What do you think about this choice of shape and materials? Alex. IP: Logged
FullerH Administrator	posted 12-28-2000 03:08 PM Quite handsome, and within character, I think, if you intend to be a wealthy or successful trader. Ebony would have had to be imported, but I think that it would have been available. ------------------ Walk in the Light, Hugh IP: Logged
Felix Member	posted 12-29-2000 02:03 PM Curiously enough, on the thread "swords of the roman empire" Joerg Bellinghausen posts a link to a German maker, among whose products is a "keltische hiebmesser" which looks very much like the sax designs under discussion here. http://www.hr-replikate.de/produkte/index.html IP: Logged
John M. Hudson Member	posted 12-30-2000 07:58 PM Just to add to the mix in the pot and help confuse things a bit. Leslie Alcock's "Arthurs Britain" (Penguin Books - 1971) has illustrations of sword finds on page 328 two of which he identifies as Sax. Thes have blades from 12 to 16' long with tangs 8 to 10" long. The tangs of the other swords and knives in the illustration are about 4 to 5" long. But as in everythig to do with swords, other times, other places, other designs. IP: Logged

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